Unhappy UKBA/BF Officers! :)

One wonders if these UKBA/BF Officers get any training whatsoever. It would seem that they have no understanding of their own regs and procedures ... especially if they are to the benefit of cross-border shoppers!



Audio to go with above video.


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This next one is our UKBA/BF friends from Doncaster Airport. Seems one of these officers is unhappy with being recorded. The rest of the officers are very friendly and accommodating to the cross border shopper.  The officer talking about 'notes' re a conversation is referring to the initial chat. He was not the one going to do the full interview, it was a female officer who was doing that. Mr Unhappy UKBA/BF Officer seemingly decided to butt in ...  that can only be classed as an epic fail! He states on audio that it's not illegal to record the interviews! lol  ... he was 'unhappy' though :)



lt is SO SO important to record the interviews ... whether the UKBA/BF are unhappy or not! :)
Both shoppers came home with their goods!

UPDATE


Had an interesting communication from some of our readers regarding UKBA/BF Officers at Hull P/O Ferries. They were stopped and searched etc  by the officers but our readers only had one recorder so they made the UKBA/BF do one interview at a time. After the first shopper's interview, he requested to go in with the second interview as backup for the 2nd shopper. He was refused but our shopper was adamant he could be present in the interview as it was Civil Law. The UKBA/BF stopped the interview and 2 of them went to the Customs House on the docks. When they returned 30 mins later, they said that our shopper could be present on the 2nd shoppers interview. That's something else UKBA/BF at Hull have 'learned'.

Slightly more worrying was there were 2 other female shoppers there and during conversation with our 2 shoppers it seemingly turned out that these 2 ladies were told that they could not record the interviews and they had to sign the notebook! One of the ladies kept her goods and the other had them seized.

The thing is, our shoppers say they know one of the officers  that had seemingly refused these ladies the right to record from a previous time. This officer (allegedly 7885) on that previous occasion had overtly been recorded and voiced no objections! It has to said though that the difference is our shoppers knew their rights and the ladies did not.  The conclusion seems to be that if don't know your rights ... some officers will act unethically.

Cross Border Shopping Trip Coach Companies Resource/Info

367 MPH!!!!!! 

Thanks to Bobi we are pleased to supply info on coach companies doing cross border shopping trips. Currently we have the dates etc for May/June. Hopefully this will help you plan your trip.

The site is here.

As for our own minibus l can inform you you that things are going well and the full mechanical work to bring the minibus to 100% serviceable will be complete shortly. There was nothing major wrong with it and main expense will be the new tyres and brake shoes etc  ... along with the full service.

We're getting there folks! :)

NEWS! re Possibly The Greatest Baccy Coach Trip In The UK

We now have a 17 seater minibus! lt is now with our mechanics who are giving it a complete overhaul and service. After that will be the fitting out of the minibus and all the compulsory stuff you must carry when abroad.

A new sound system will be installed with a library of approx 1500 albums. SatNav UK,EU and ROI and asap a TV with separate DVD (incl mem cards) facilities. We also want hot drinks but have to look at which way we'll go with that as to the hot water. Cold drinks will be no problem. Oh, and not forgetting the new ashtrays! :)

We are not rushing this as we want everything to be 100% right including all the legal stuff. Which reminds me, the minibus will always carry all the legal docs and FOI's should we encounter the UKBA/Border Force.

Which leaves us with the Social Club ... any ideas for any names? l quite like the idea of having graphics on the minibus :)

Need to add cigarette

Perhaps a 'smoking cigarette' decal for each mission accomplished? :)

We'll keep you updated of the progress of our minibus.

Your Attention Please

My daughter is doing a project in the support of Animal Welfare and Dove House Hospice (both very good causes with hard working dedicated people).  The project is also for her 1st year photographic course at college. Please pop over and give her some moral support ... it's her first blog. Her blog is here.
(Just in case you're wondering ... her younger sister is the professional photographer l've mentioned before.)


OTHER NEWS


I'm going to look at some minibuses today!

Possibly The Greatest Baccy Coach Trip In The UK

Our Bus Hostesses?

We are considering purchasing a 15-17 seater minibus and forming a Social Club. The minibus would be insured for any driver over 25, have RAC breakdown cover, insured for EU use, smoking and drinking allowed (perhaps mandatory), wheelchair access, EU Sat Nav and so on.

We would do the Hull and Dover routes (possibly others) and these would be open to any members. You would have to register as a member of the club and would then be issued with a membership card.

The Dover routes have good deals for group bookings as does P&O Hull. Any group bookings over 10 and the minibus goes free.

The Social Club would be non-profit but would require a small donation from any members using the minibus to donate to the 'maintenance fund' to keep the minibus in tip-top condition etc. Because the minibus would be insured for any driver over 25, we can see no reason why any member cannot take the minibus themselves without us if they so want. Obviously we'd have to 'know' these members.

We see the logistics of this being quite easy to do even though we are based in Yorkshire. Say you are planning a trip on the Dover route and live further down South. Then we'd send a driver down with the minibus and you pay for the fuel and this driver would then perhaps come with you (if there are spaces) or you can put them up in your home till you get back. Anyway, you get the idea.

Our local Normandy Veterans Association are interested because they make various pilgrimages to the Normandy beaches and Commonwealth Graves every year. Any spaces on these trips would be available to members. Be warned though ... these old boys can be a handful(they smoke and drink). On one of their trips, one of their comrades passed away ... and they put him on the coach to bring him home ... without telling the driver! The police pulled them over on the motorway!

We have to stress that these baccy trips will be for legitimate cross-border shoppers only! There will be no limits on the amount of tobacco you purchase for personal use. We expect you to be fully prepared and adhere to all our advice for any hassle from UKBA/BF you may encounter. I sincerely doubt UKBA/BF will be prepared for us!

So that's what we are considering. We'll keep you informed of any developments ... and NO, the minbus won't be like this:-

**UPDATED** Tobacco Coach Trips, Listings and Ratings

A good friend of ours is compiling a list of coach companies that do tobacco shopping trips to Belgium/France via the ferries and the tunnel. We intend to keep this up to date and informative. lf you know of any coach companies that do this that are not listed by us ... please tell us about them and how good they are and we'll add them to the list.

This is the listing so far   May dates 2012

We want to go further than this because some of the coach companies look as though they are run by the UKBA! What's the bloody point of going on a trip for a mere 1kg of tobacco for god's sake? They are doing UKBA's job for them! To us they are the UKBA/Border Force in disguise and we would never use them.

So here's our view on the coach companies .... the good, fair and the bad.

GOOD


FIVE STAR GROUP TRAVEL  (Liverpool)

EUROSUN  (Lowestoft, Suffolk. Southrepps, Norfolk)

AVISTA (Chesterfield)

COACH INNOVATIONS (Kidderminster)

GODSON'S TRAVEL (Leeds)

BUZZLINES TRAVEL (Hythe, Kent)

CHENERY TRAVEL (Norwich)

GROSVENOR (Birmingham)

ROSS TRAVEL (Featherstone)

COLISEUM COACHES (Southampton)


LJ EDWARDS (Hallsham, East Sussex)

BARCROFT (St Leonards, East Sussex)


These companies impose no limits according to recent contact with them but you have to be aware that if UKBA/Border Force are interviewing you that these interviews could and do last for hours. You can't realistically expect the coach to wait that long for you so you'll have to make a choice. Either arrange with UKBA/BF for a interview at a later date or you let the coach go and make your own way back. Of course this being left behind is used by UKBA/BF to pressurise you into leaving your goods! Be ready for this tactic.


***********************************
FAIR

TOURS R US (Southend)

This company imposes a limit of 3200 cigarettes/3kg of tobacco. Better than the guidelines but still pants in our eyes.

************************************
UNSATISFACTORY

HARRY SHAW (Coventry)

I've put Harry Shaw here unless l hear from a customer otherwise. They state online that HMRC suggested limits should be strictly adhered to. When l rang them they started quoting me limits and allowances as stated by HMRC that they had on their walls 'from' HMRC. Whether HMRC had sent something out like this l don't know. l wouldn't put it past them. I told them there was no such thing but they kept saying that's what it says! Anyway, upshot was l asked them if l brought 5kg onboard would the driver stop me ... they said no. So, it's up to you whether you use them or not.


*******************************
BAD


CROSSKEYS (Folkestone)
(In their own words:- Our company policy is to follow the HM Revenue & Customs guide lines of 1kg of tobacco only, we will not carry any more than this amount per person. Should you book with us it would be in accordance with our company policy.
Our driver reserves the right to check passenger bags for excessive amounts tobacco, in the event of excessive amounts being found the driver will refuse to carry the goods.)


*********************************
IMPORTANT


If you are using one of these companies DON'T be an idiot and try and hide tobacco on the coach! You put the coach company at risk of their coach being seized! l don't think the rest of the passengers will be pleased about this and even less so with you!

*********************************

CAN WE DO IT OURSELVES?


Our friend also put forward the possibility of doing it ourselves and by ourselves l mean all of us together. We'd need a basic mini-bus and perhaps run not as a business but along the lines of lifts for 'friends'? That way we could smoke in it :) Your thoughts would be appreciated.

UKBA Solicitors Threaten 68yr old Pensioner Again!!!

LAW AT THE HEART OF GOVERNMENT

Treasury Solicitor's Department
One Kemble Street,
London
WC2B 4TS
OX 123242 Kingsway
Switchboard: (020) 7210 3000 (GTN 210) Direct Line: (020) 7210 3270
Direct Fax: (020) 7210 3072/2996 Jessica. DaCosta@tsol.gsi.gov.uk


Dear Mr *************

Your website MuggedByUKBA

We are aware that you run a website, MuggedByUKBA

It has come to our attention that this website contains a number of comments about individual UKBA staff members (notably Mr Ian Sked) which are of an extremely aggressive and personal nature.

Whilst we respect your right to comment on UKBA's activities, we view individual attacks on UKBA staff as unacceptable. We therefore ask that you remove the comments relating to Mr Sked and anyone else in UKBA who is mentioned by name immediately. If you do not comply, we reserve the right to take further action against the site and its authors.

Yours faithfully
/?;?~~~.'
Jessica Da Costa
For the Treasury solicitor

*************************************

Perhaps we should write to Ms Costa?

Dear Ms Costa


Your agency UKBA


We are aware you represent an agency, UKBA


It has come to our attention that UKBA on a number of occasions made comments to members of the public (notably cross-border shoppers) which are extremely aggressive and intimidatory.


Whilst we respect their right to do their job, we view individual attacks on members of the public as unacceptable. We therefore ask you to remove these unethical tactics relating to members of the public and anyone else who legitimately cross-border shops immediately. If you do not comply, we reserve the right to continue action against the agency and its staff.


Yours faithfully


Smoking Hot
For the legitimate cross-border shoppers


Pop over to George's place and give him some support.

**UPDATED** UKBA/Border Force Back To Their Old Tricks

We received this e-mail from one of our friends who was on a coach trip last week :-

"There are lots of coaches going through the tunnel this morning, Dutch, French, Polish and us, a nice English shopping trip coach.  As we pull up at the Border Control offices we are told we have to take everything off the coach and go through with it.  You just know we are going to take a hit, stands out a mile when they say that.

So, everyone grabs their goods and heads for Passport control, you can see the bruisers lining up behind them and there are a lot of them, they have come mob handed (do they really need boots that big?). As I wait to have my passport scanned I notice a few people sitting down everybody, who has just had their passport scanned anyway, is asked to present their passport again to the guys in UKBA coats (oh and one little girl, though she appears to be a trainee).

“Hello, passport please”

Well at least he is polite.

“What have you bought?” I tell him 3 kilos of Springfield HRT.

“When were you last over, what did you buy then, how long will it last you, have you ever had any dealings with customs etc”

Then he asks if I have the receipt, fair enough I hand it to him.

Then comes something new.  He slips the receipt in my passport, points to the benches and asks me to take a seat.  The problem is, by this time, they have seized so many passports and receipts, there is no room left to sit down!

Gradually they collect the passports and receipts of the majority of the passengers, the young girl I mentioned, she carries away a bundle of passports so thick she can hardly get her hand round it and other “officers” also carry a few away.

All goes quiet at this point, apart from all the other visitors from the EU passing through scanning control and being sent on their merry way, their coaches could have been loaded to the gunnels with contraband and they weren’t even sniffed at from what I could see!  They must have processed 5 coaches just while they were hitting on us at stage one.

After a good long wait, possibly 30 minutes in my case, one of the “officers” comes out and shouts my name, I walk up, he hands me back my passport, I say thank you, get no explanation, and walk out of the building to be greeted by the travellers who had just been passed without let or hindrance.  Same “officer” that called my name, called a lady after me and she followed me out.  I think they did this with a few people, I put my goods back on the coach and it was empty bar a couple of people and the drivers.  This was going to be a messy one.

In the end I think 3 or 4 people had their good seized, at least one was told not to come back for 9 months and another told 6 months or their goods would be seized.  It was cold, windy occasionally wet and from being stopped to getting rolling again it was 2 hours 22 minutes according to my recording device.  This is only hearsay but someone said one of the “officers” had told someone “that coach is marked, it will get pulled every time” though it appears it was in a stage whisper type affair “I shouldn’t tell you this but”.

The mass seizure of passports is a new one on me.  I am wondering if they were taken off to be scanned with the receipts for future reference.  It was obviously a scare tactic, especially when combined with the stage whisper, which it must have been known would be spread among the passengers.

Is this an attempt to wreck a legitimate business, as well as frighten the nervous shoppers?

One of the drivers was saying that the previous week they had virtually been waved through (they go every Friday night).

Unfortunately in my mad dash out of the house I forgot to pick up the cards for N2D, but I did talk with a few people and tell them about the site.  At least one of the group is I hear, going to appeal against their seizure.

All in all a quite eventful trip, wonder what will happen next time"
..........................................................................


UKBA/Border Force are acting illegally again! They are simply not allowed to do this. They can't detain and delay a complete coach full of passengers without having reasonable grounds for doing so. 
What's worse is then they ask questions in the hope of of obtaining grounds for a subsequent search.
lt states in their own manual the following :-

"When exercising the powers at sections 163 or 163A an officer MUST have reasonable grounds for

the initial stop. Officers must not stop someone in the hope of obtaining grounds through

questioning to support a subsequent search."

What then followed was simply unbelievable. After the passengers had had their passports scanned at Immigration Control and proceeded to Customs Control, other UKBA/Border Force Officers then asked for the passenger's passports to be handed over!

Just who the hell do they think they are? They can ask for ID but they can't ask specifically for the passport. The passport isn't actually owned by you but it takes the Secretary of State to take it off you. UKBA/Border Force have no right to it ... period. They can ask for ID but that doesn't mean you have to show them your passport and it certainly does not mean you have to hand it over.

Show them some other form of ID, something like your driving licence is good :-

Personally, l blank out my d.o.b, number and address with removable coach tape ... it's still ID and shows who l am. Ask them for their ID first ... then you'll see how much they themselves are loathe to do so. Don't answer any questions until they identify themselves. The most you'll probably get from them is their ID number, l doubt very much they'll show you their photo ID. Yet, they want you to give everything ... don't do it! You are under no legal obligation to do so. Show them your preferred ID but don't give them it.

The problem is that UKBA/Border Force are not ordering you to do it .... they are asking for your consent ... listen carefully to what they actually say and not what you think they are saying. If you give consent, you can blame nobody but yourself. l know it's a bit scary to say "I do not consent" but you'll find that nothing bad happens to you. All them scare stories about arrests and rubber gloves etc are just urban myths .... we speak from experience! First time you stand up and be counted can be scary ... the 2nd time is easy and it gets easier. 

You have to make a stand for what is right. If you don't, they'll just keep on doing it ... because you let them!

Oh, and don't forget to record the whole thing! :)

UPDATE

Seems l have to clarify what l'm saying. I'm not advocating whole out rebellion (which to be truthful l'd like). What l'm saying is when they act like East Berlin Border Guards by herding 30-45 passengers from a coach and then harass and intimidate them by abusing their own regulations, the passengers should not remain subdued and subservient.

Get to know the people you are travelling with and don't be isolated. Make your concerns heard and speak in groups. Begin with asking the UKBA/Border Force Officers for their ID and tell them you are recording them.  That'll be enough to get their attention. Question by what regulations they are doing this to you. Don't be aggressive about it, simply be calm and collected ... and record everything. Voice your complaints and then when you get back home put in an official complaint if you want.

Make it difficult for them by asking these questions and getting their answers recorded on your dictaphones/mobile phones. lf you remain docile and subservient then you are condoning what the UKBA/Border Force are doing. Bullies feed of this so don't do it.

l'm not asking people to do what we do, all l'm saying is voice your concerns and stand together.